Devuan logs - #882, boring messages

Message sent to [email protected], [email protected]:

Subject: bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
Reply-To: Opty <[email protected]>, [email protected]
Resent-From: Opty <[email protected]>
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From: Opty <[email protected]>
Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2025 14:41:25 +0200
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Package: lighttpd
Version: 1.4.69-1

/etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd uses invoke-rc.d to notify lighttpd to
reopen logs but it doesn't work when using
policy-rcd-declarative-deny-all so shouldn't the logrotate
configuration snippet use rather 'service' ?

Regards,
Opty

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From: "Devuan bug Tracking System" <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>
Subject: bug#882: Acknowledgement (/etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable
 use of invoke-rc.d)
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <CAERDJOE5eNxeErD=xLsVPWN5jfodbn06BYHXz5QiCcdz3jmxnQ@mail.gmail.com>
X-Devuan-PR-Message: ack 882
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Reply-To: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 01 Apr 2025 12:44:02 +0000

Thank you for filing a new bug report with Devuan.

You can follow progress on this bug here: 882: https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/=
bugreport.cgi?bug=3D882.

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--=20
882: https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D882
Devuan Bug Tracking System
Contact [email protected] with problems

Message sent to [email protected], [email protected]:

Subject: bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
Reply-To: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>, [email protected]
Resent-From: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
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Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2025 17:36:48 +0100
From: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>, [email protected]
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Control: tags -1 debian

Opty,

On Tue, Apr 01, 2025 at 02:41:25PM +0200, Opty wrote:
> Package: lighttpd
> Version: 1.4.69-1
> 
> /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd uses invoke-rc.d to notify lighttpd to
> reopen logs but it doesn't work when using
> policy-rcd-declarative-deny-all so shouldn't the logrotate
> configuration snippet use rather 'service' ?

Possibly, but I am not sure. Certainly all the other /etc/logrotate.d examples I
can find use invoke-rc.d. It may be to prevent rotation in chroots and the like
when it would fail.

However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this should be
reported directly to Debian's BTS.

Thanks

Mark

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Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2025 17:36:48 +0100
From: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>, [email protected]
Subject: Re: bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of
 invoke-rc.d
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <CAERDJOE5eNxeErD=xLsVPWN5jfodbn06BYHXz5QiCcdz3jmxnQ@mail.gmail.com>
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Control: tags -1 debian

Opty,

On Tue, Apr 01, 2025 at 02:41:25PM +0200, Opty wrote:
> Package: lighttpd
> Version: 1.4.69-1
> 
> /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd uses invoke-rc.d to notify lighttpd to
> reopen logs but it doesn't work when using
> policy-rcd-declarative-deny-all so shouldn't the logrotate
> configuration snippet use rather 'service' ?

Possibly, but I am not sure. Certainly all the other /etc/logrotate.d examples I
can find use invoke-rc.d. It may be to prevent rotation in chroots and the like
when it would fail.

However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this should be
reported directly to Debian's BTS.

Thanks

Mark

Message sent to [email protected], [email protected]:

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Subject: bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
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Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 13:56:10 +0200
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To: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
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On Tue, Apr 1, 2025 at 6:36=E2=80=AFPM Mark Hindley <[email protected]> w=
rote:
> However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this shoul=
d be
> reported directly to Debian's BTS.

Now that Debian uses systemd by default I considered Devuan a better
place for System V style init stuff but I will think about reporting
to Debian BTS then.

Regards,
Opty

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From: "Devuan bug Tracking System" <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>
Subject: bug#882: Info received (bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd:
 Questionable use of invoke-rc.d)
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <CAERDJOHUES6YsTpgN_fEp8K6mf4oXbMrsZqN0MPsHs+bU5BawA@mail.gmail.com>
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Reply-To: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2025 11:58:02 +0000

Thank you for the additional information you have supplied regarding
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--=20
882: https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D882
Devuan Bug Tracking System
Contact [email protected] with problems

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Subject: bug#882: [devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
Reply-To: Lorenzo <[email protected]>, [email protected]
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Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 14:12:08 +0200
From: Lorenzo <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected], devuan developers internal list
 <[email protected]>, Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
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On Wed, 2 Apr 2025 13:56:10 +0200
Opty <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Tue, Apr 1, 2025 at 6:36=E2=80=AFPM Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> > However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this
> > should be reported directly to Debian's BTS.
>=20
> Now that Debian uses systemd by default I considered Devuan a better
> place for System V style init stuff but I will think about reporting
> to Debian BTS then.

Please don't: while this may solve your use case it will break other
more common use cases that are currently working.
Example:
lighttpd installed but disabled by the local admin (K links) but if
service wrapper is used instead of invoke-rc.d the logrotate snippet
will try to signal lighttpd regardless, which should not happen.

on a side note, runit is currently using invoke-rc.d to forward
logrotate actions to runit services, so your change would break that too

Regards,
Lorenzo

>=20
> Regards,
> Opty
> _______________________________________________
> devuan-dev internal mailing list
> [email protected]
> Manage your subscription:
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From: "Devuan bug Tracking System" <[email protected]>
To: Lorenzo <[email protected]>
Subject: bug#882: Info received ([devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd:
 Questionable use of invoke-rc.d)
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
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Reply-To: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2025 12:14:03 +0000

Thank you for the additional information you have supplied regarding
this bug report.

This is an automatically generated reply to let you know your message
has been received.

Your message is being forwarded to the package maintainers and other
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If you wish to submit further information on this problem, please
send it to [email protected].

Please do not send mail to [email protected] unless you wish
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--=20
882: https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D882
Devuan Bug Tracking System
Contact [email protected] with problems

Message sent to [email protected], [email protected]:

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Subject: bug#882: [devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
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Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 14:42:19 +0200
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On Wed, Apr 2, 2025 at 2:12=E2=80=AFPM Lorenzo <[email protected]> wrote=
:
> On Wed, 2 Apr 2025 13:56:10 +0200
> Opty <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Now that Debian uses systemd by default I considered Devuan a better
> > place for System V style init stuff but I will think about reporting
> > to Debian BTS then.
>
> Please don't: while this may solve your use case it will break other
> more common use cases that are currently working.
> Example:
> lighttpd installed but disabled by the local admin (K links) but if
> service wrapper is used instead of invoke-rc.d the logrotate snippet
> will try to signal lighttpd regardless, which should not happen.

Good, no work for me. :-)

I should have written that I was actually afraid of something like
that in general but 'service' seemed as the best proposal at that
time. See also #881.

Regards,
Opty

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Subject: bug#882: Info received ([devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd:
 Questionable use of invoke-rc.d)
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On Wed, Apr 2, 2025 at 2:42=E2=80=AFPM Opty <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 2, 2025 at 2:12=E2=80=AFPM Lorenzo <[email protected]> wro=
te:
> > Please don't: while this may solve your use case it will break other
> > more common use cases that are currently working.
> > Example:
> > lighttpd installed but disabled by the local admin (K links) but if
> > service wrapper is used instead of invoke-rc.d the logrotate snippet
> > will try to signal lighttpd regardless, which should not happen.
>
> Good, no work for me. :-)
>
> I should have written that I was actually afraid of something like
> that in general but 'service' seemed as the best proposal at that
> time. See also #881.

I recalled why I proposed 'service' and even reported all of these:

"invoke-rc.d and policy-rc.d are precisely interfaces expected to be
used only by maintainer scripts. Anything else done during run-time
should be using some other interface, such as service(8) for example
or an init specific one, otherwise that should be considered a bug."

and

"In case this is a local problem where you have deployed
non-maintainer scripts using invoke-rc.d, then while you fix those,
you could check in policy-rc.d if you are running inside dpkg by
checking if the environment variable DPKG_RUNNING_VERSION is defined
(documented in dpkg(1))."

(see https://bugs.debian.org/804018#25)

Regards,
Opty

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From: "Devuan bug Tracking System" <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>
Subject: bug#882: Info received ([devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd:
 Questionable use of invoke-rc.d)
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
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Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2025 13:22:03 +0000

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Control: forcemerge 881 -1

On Wed, Apr 02, 2025 at 01:58:20PM +0200, Opty wrote:
> Please see #881 or should I copy the story here as well?

No. Really these are all the same issue. I will merge them for now while we look
at the detail.

Mark

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From: "Devuan bug Tracking System" <[email protected]>
To: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
Subject: bug#882: Info received (Merge bugs)
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
X-Devuan-PR-Message: ack-info 882
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Reply-To: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2025 16:14:02 +0000

Thank you for the additional information you have supplied regarding
this bug report.

This is an automatically generated reply to let you know your message
has been received.

Your message is being forwarded to the package maintainers and other
interested parties for their attention; they will reply in due course.

Your message has been sent to the package maintainer(s):
 [email protected]

If you wish to submit further information on this problem, please
send it to [email protected].

Please do not send mail to [email protected] unless you wish
to report a problem with the Bug-tracking system.

--=20
882: https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D882
Devuan Bug Tracking System
Contact [email protected] with problems

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Subject: reassign 882, 883 and 884 to init-system-helpers, forcemerge with
 881 init-system-helpers
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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks

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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks

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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks

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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks

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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks

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 881 init-system-helpers
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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks

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 881 init-system-helpers
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From: mark <[email protected]>

reassign 882 init-system-helpers
forcemerge 881 882
reassign 883 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 883
reassign 884 init-system-helpers 
forcemerge 881 884
thanks