Devuan bug report logs - #882
/etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d

Package: init-system-helpers; Reported by: Opty <[email protected]>; Keywords: debian moreinfo; merged with #881, #883, #884; dated Tue, 1 Apr 2025 12:44:01 UTC; Maintainer for init-system-helpers is Devuan Dev Team <[email protected]>.
Merged 881 882 883 884 Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.
Merged 881 882 883 Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.
Merged 881 882 Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.
Added tag(s) moreinfo. Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.
Marked as found in versions init-system-helpers/1.65.2devuan1. Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.
No longer marked as found in versions 1.4.69-1. Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.
bug reassigned from package 'lighttpd' to 'init-system-helpers'. Request was from mark <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.

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From: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Merge bugs
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Control: forcemerge 881 -1

On Wed, Apr 02, 2025 at 01:58:20PM +0200, Opty wrote:
> Please see #881 or should I copy the story here as well?

No. Really these are all the same issue. I will merge them for now while we look
at the detail.

Mark

Acknowledgement sent to Mark Hindley <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to [email protected]. Full text available.
Information forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.

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From: Opty <[email protected]>
Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 15:20:39 +0200
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Subject: Re: [devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use
 of invoke-rc.d
To: Lorenzo <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected], Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
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On Wed, Apr 2, 2025 at 2:42=E2=80=AFPM Opty <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 2, 2025 at 2:12=E2=80=AFPM Lorenzo <[email protected]> wro=
te:
> > Please don't: while this may solve your use case it will break other
> > more common use cases that are currently working.
> > Example:
> > lighttpd installed but disabled by the local admin (K links) but if
> > service wrapper is used instead of invoke-rc.d the logrotate snippet
> > will try to signal lighttpd regardless, which should not happen.
>
> Good, no work for me. :-)
>
> I should have written that I was actually afraid of something like
> that in general but 'service' seemed as the best proposal at that
> time. See also #881.

I recalled why I proposed 'service' and even reported all of these:

"invoke-rc.d and policy-rc.d are precisely interfaces expected to be
used only by maintainer scripts. Anything else done during run-time
should be using some other interface, such as service(8) for example
or an init specific one, otherwise that should be considered a bug."

and

"In case this is a local problem where you have deployed
non-maintainer scripts using invoke-rc.d, then while you fix those,
you could check in policy-rc.d if you are running inside dpkg by
checking if the environment variable DPKG_RUNNING_VERSION is defined
(documented in dpkg(1))."

(see https://bugs.debian.org/804018#25)

Regards,
Opty

Acknowledgement sent to Opty <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to [email protected]. Full text available.
Information forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.

Message received at [email protected]:


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From: Opty <[email protected]>
Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 14:42:19 +0200
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Subject: Re: [devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use
 of invoke-rc.d
To: Lorenzo <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected], Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
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On Wed, Apr 2, 2025 at 2:12=E2=80=AFPM Lorenzo <[email protected]> wrote=
:
> On Wed, 2 Apr 2025 13:56:10 +0200
> Opty <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Now that Debian uses systemd by default I considered Devuan a better
> > place for System V style init stuff but I will think about reporting
> > to Debian BTS then.
>
> Please don't: while this may solve your use case it will break other
> more common use cases that are currently working.
> Example:
> lighttpd installed but disabled by the local admin (K links) but if
> service wrapper is used instead of invoke-rc.d the logrotate snippet
> will try to signal lighttpd regardless, which should not happen.

Good, no work for me. :-)

I should have written that I was actually afraid of something like
that in general but 'service' seemed as the best proposal at that
time. See also #881.

Regards,
Opty

Acknowledgement sent to Opty <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to [email protected]. Full text available.
Information forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.

Message received at [email protected]:


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Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 14:12:08 +0200
From: Lorenzo <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected], devuan developers internal list
 <[email protected]>, Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [devuan-dev] bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable
 use of invoke-rc.d
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
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References: <CAERDJOE5eNxeErD=xLsVPWN5jfodbn06BYHXz5QiCcdz3jmxnQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<[email protected]>
	<CAERDJOE5eNxeErD=xLsVPWN5jfodbn06BYHXz5QiCcdz3jmxnQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAERDJOHUES6YsTpgN_fEp8K6mf4oXbMrsZqN0MPsHs+bU5BawA@mail.gmail.com>
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On Wed, 2 Apr 2025 13:56:10 +0200
Opty <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Tue, Apr 1, 2025 at 6:36=E2=80=AFPM Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> > However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this
> > should be reported directly to Debian's BTS.
>=20
> Now that Debian uses systemd by default I considered Devuan a better
> place for System V style init stuff but I will think about reporting
> to Debian BTS then.

Please don't: while this may solve your use case it will break other
more common use cases that are currently working.
Example:
lighttpd installed but disabled by the local admin (K links) but if
service wrapper is used instead of invoke-rc.d the logrotate snippet
will try to signal lighttpd regardless, which should not happen.

on a side note, runit is currently using invoke-rc.d to forward
logrotate actions to runit services, so your change would break that too

Regards,
Lorenzo

>=20
> Regards,
> Opty
> _______________________________________________
> devuan-dev internal mailing list
> [email protected]
> Manage your subscription:
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devuan-dev
> Archive: https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/list/devuan-dev.en.html


Acknowledgement sent to Lorenzo <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to [email protected]. Full text available.
Information forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.

Message received at [email protected]:


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Subject: Re: bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
To: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Tue, Apr 1, 2025 at 6:36=E2=80=AFPM Mark Hindley <[email protected]> w=
rote:
> However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this shoul=
d be
> reported directly to Debian's BTS.

Now that Debian uses systemd by default I considered Devuan a better
place for System V style init stuff but I will think about reporting
to Debian BTS then.

Regards,
Opty

Acknowledgement sent to Opty <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to [email protected]. Full text available.
Information forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.
Added tag(s) debian. Request was from Mark Hindley <[email protected]> to [email protected]. Full text available.

Message received at [email protected]:


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Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2025 17:36:48 +0100
From: Mark Hindley <[email protected]>
To: Opty <[email protected]>, [email protected]
Subject: Re: bug#882: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of
 invoke-rc.d
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
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Control: tags -1 debian

Opty,

On Tue, Apr 01, 2025 at 02:41:25PM +0200, Opty wrote:
> Package: lighttpd
> Version: 1.4.69-1
> 
> /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd uses invoke-rc.d to notify lighttpd to
> reopen logs but it doesn't work when using
> policy-rcd-declarative-deny-all so shouldn't the logrotate
> configuration snippet use rather 'service' ?

Possibly, but I am not sure. Certainly all the other /etc/logrotate.d examples I
can find use invoke-rc.d. It may be to prevent rotation in chroots and the like
when it would fail.

However, I am sure that lighttpd isn't forked in Devuan and so this should be
reported directly to Debian's BTS.

Thanks

Mark

Information forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.

Message received at [email protected]:


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Subject: /etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd: Questionable use of invoke-rc.d
To: [email protected]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

Package: lighttpd
Version: 1.4.69-1

/etc/logrotate.d/lighttpd uses invoke-rc.d to notify lighttpd to
reopen logs but it doesn't work when using
policy-rcd-declarative-deny-all so shouldn't the logrotate
configuration snippet use rather 'service' ?

Regards,
Opty

Acknowledgement sent to Opty <[email protected]>:
New bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to [email protected]. Full text available.
Report forwarded to [email protected], [email protected]:
bug#882; Package lighttpd. Full text available.

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